ASHLYNNE:

Gabe, congratulations to your family. Take me to the moment where you heard your brother Julian Assange was about to be freed. Where were you? What were you doing?

GABRIEL:

Well, I've been, you know, chatting to Julian in the lead up to this. You know, we were speaking every day.

Julian called me and just before he had to get into a van to travel to the airport and I was just arriving in France and I was waiting for my bags at the carousel and chatting to Julian about, you know, what he was getting ready for the next morning where he had to essentially be snuck out of the prison.

He had to wait for quite a few hours inside one of these prisoner transport vans before waiting inside a lounge at Stansted Airport for four hours there as well, before getting on a plane. But, one of the interesting things is that Julian's plane is the second most tracked plane on Flight Tracker. It might have actually become the first most tracked plane, but the plane he's in competition with at the moment is Taylor Swift's jet. So the people watching Taylor Swift's jet outnumber the people watching Julian's jet but Julian's jet is a close second on the flight trackers.

ASHLYNNE:

It's pretty bizarre, isn't it? What was the reason? What was all this secrecy about, you know, being snuck out of the prison at 2am – what was that about?

GABRIEL:

Well until this deal was done and until Julian signed before a judge, it was a very delicate thing that could have become unravelled at any time. And so keeping it secret as long as we could meant that it wasn't open to influence from outside parties that could have brought the whole deal down. So, yeah, I think that was a necessary element to keep that secrecy. I had to keep it secret from, you know, some family and loved ones who were not so happy, or very surprised. When I spoke to my daughter she said, “oh, dad, did you know about this?” And I'm like, “yes, yes, Rose”. And she's actually over the moon. She'd be like, “I can't believe we can go and see Julian and my cousins”. She was over the moon when she heard the news as well.

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ASHLYNNE:

From Schwartz Media, I’m Ashlynne McGhee. This is 7am.

When Gabe Assange jumped on our Zoom call, I’m not sure I’ve ever seen him with such a big smile. His brother Julian Assange is back on home soil after more than a decade in exile and in prison.

Slowly we’re starting to learn more about how this extraordinary deal between Australia and the US came together and the secret midnight manoeuvres to get him safely out of the UK.

Today Gabe Shipton takes us inside the last 72 hours, but first The Saturday Paper’s Mike Seccombe on how it all unfolded.

That’s after the break.

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ASHLYNNE:

Mike, Julian Assange will have landed in Australia a free man by the time our listeners hear this. What do we know about how this has come about?

MIKE:

Well, to be honest Ash, not a lot at this stage. As someone in the government put it to me when I was trying to find out more about this, they said they didn't want to begin their victory lap as they described it, until the process was done and Assange was safe. So, you know, they've acknowledged that the process is in train, but they're not saying much more than that. What we do know is that around 2am on Monday in Belmarsh prison, Assange was woken up by the guards and he was escorted out into a secure vehicle to transfer him to an airport, to a plane.

The first the world knew was when Wikileaks, the organisation he started, posted a video of him boarding that plane and subsequent to that it was quickly revealed that the US Justice Department had offered a deal which would see him plead guilty to just one count, conspiring to unlawfully obtain and disseminate classified information, but that under that deal he would be sentenced but only to the time served already in Belmarsh. So effectively he would be free to walk after that.

So he got on the plane in the UK. It was an Australian government chartered plane and then on to the US territory of Saipan in the middle of the Pacific Ocean, where he could plead guilty in front of a US judge.

Audio excerpt — ABC News:

“He arrived just under an hour ago and he's expected at this court to face court here at 9am local time, which is the same time as Eastern Standard in Australia."

Audio excerpt — Journalist:

“Mr Assange, any comments?”

MIKE:

He was walking into a US court alongside the Australian ambassador to the US, Kevin Rudd, and the UK High Commissioner, Stephen Smith, to plead guilty to that one count. Interestingly, he didn't offer it meekly either. There was a long pause when he was asked whether he accepted that he was guilty of the charge and then he explained to the judge that he was entering the guilty plea because as he said, quoting, “working as a journalist, I encouraged my source to provide information that was said to be classified in order to publish that information”. And he went on to say, “I believe the First Amendment protected that activity. I believe the First Amendment and the Espionage Act are in contradiction”. His legal representative then jumped in to make it absolutely clear that he was nonetheless pleading guilty and the explanation was given that he was pleading guilty because fighting the case before the courts would be challenging.

Audio excerpt — Assange’s Lawyer:

“It is appropriate, though, for this fight to end, and it is appropriate for the judge, as she did today, to determine that no additional incarceration of Mr Assange would be fair, would be appropriate, and it is time for him to be reunited with his family.”

ASHLYNNE:

So Mike, Julian Assange might be free, but he's still accepted a deal that involved admitting guilt to this really serious espionage charge. So what sort of precedent does that set?

MIKE:

Well, I mean, this is in a way, kind of a show trial played out on a very small stage in the middle of the Pacific. So what the deal does is it sets a practical precedent that a publisher can be convicted under the Espionage Act in the US and it's an outcome that media rights organisations have long feared. So no doubt it will have a chilling effect on those who would reveal uncomfortable truths about the conduct of government. Interestingly, I think and I would note as others have, that the US authorities have had considerable difficulty in balancing the Espionage Act against the First Amendment. You know, the Obama administration wanted to pursue Assange, but didn't. It did happen under the Trump administration that charges were laid, but notably they've only ever gone after Assange. And as we all know, he had partners in publishing a lot of that information. You know, some of the biggest papers in the world, you know, The New York Times, The Guardian and other news organisations in Europe. We'll see how it progresses from here.

Audio excerpt — Jen Robinson:

“This is a huge win for Australia that our Prime Minister stood up to our ally, the United States and demanded the return of an Australian citizen. And that Julian came home today.”

Audio excerpt — Anthony Albanese:

“If you look at the whole range of people who've been to the United States, I'm surprised that some of it was missed by the people in this room. Some of the visits, but not up to me to indicate that. Go back and have a look at some diaries and who has travelled to the United States in recent months.”

MIKE:

Most importantly, I think he's been reunited with his wife, Stella.

Audio excerpt — Stella Assange:

“It took millions of people. It took people working behind the scenes, people protesting on the streets for days and weeks and months and years, and we achieved it.”

MIKE:

Julian's wife, Stella Assange, has said they will still seek a pardon because of these concerns that the journalists around the world could be open to espionage charges.

Audio excerpt — Stella Assange:

“Julian wanted me to sincerely thank everyone. He wanted to be here but you have to understand what he's been through. He needs time. He needs to recuperate. And this is a process. I ask you, please, to give us space. To give us privacy to find our place, to let our family be a family before he can speak again at a time of his choosing.”

MIKE:

There are questions about his future, I guess. Will he publish again? Will he continue to pursue these activities that have had such dire consequences for him? What will he do now? You know, will he just settle back into family life? You have to think that given the frenetic pursuit of what he sees as the truth in the past, that that won't be an easy adjustment for him to make. So, you know, obviously these answers will come down the track. But right now, it's a huge moment for him and his family, including people like his brother Gabriel Shipton, who were just overjoyed that we finally have Julian free.

ASHLYNNE:

After the break, what Gabriel Shipton hopes his brother does next.

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ASHLYNNE:

Gabe, have you had a chance yet to chat to your brother since he’s walked out?

GABRIEL:

Yeah, we've exchanged some texts but it's all been pretty functional at the moment. No reflections just yet. So yeah, as I said, we're really focussed on getting him home intact and safe and sound and making sure that all the logistics are sorted and, yeah, but, I'll be looking forward to kicking back and having a beer with him sometime in the next few weeks. So, it'll be good.

ASHLYNNE:

So talk to me a little bit more about what's been involved in this, because you kind of alluded to it there that you've been chatting to him about the details as all these sort of puzzle pieces fell into place. How did this all unfold? What kind of background manoeuvring was going on?

GABRIEL:

Well, this has been a huge global campaign. I think it's important to acknowledge that this is the pointy end of a very long campaign that many millions of people have been working on and acknowledge that work, that political work, as well as the work of the lawyers and as well as the work of, you know, the Australian government who have been able to negotiate this deal along with Julian's lawyers. But I think, in terms of all the little bits and pieces, all the little negotiations that had to have this deal come together, that was all done by Julian's lawyers and the diplomatic efforts of the Australian government. I think the Australian government has pulled off a miracle, but basically they've managed to satisfy the intelligence community and the national security of the Department of Justice, but also secure Julian's freedom. So you had James Clapper coming out today saying, you know, that the intelligence community is satisfied that they've got their pound of flesh, with the time served and this Espionage Act conviction, but Julian's also free. So, I think an incredible balancing act that's been pulled off by the Australian diplomats as well as Julian's lawyers. And in terms of these little bits and pieces that were being negotiated, like going to this district in the Northern Mariana Islands. That was one of the key pieces, that Julian not go to the United States, the mainland United States. And they figured out this neat solution where he could go to this location on the way home, plead guilty before a judge, have that plea accepted and then fly six hours down to Canberra. So it's those little bits and pieces that were organised and I think really made this deal acceptable to Julian and the national security arm of the Department of Justice.

ASHLYNNE:

So, given all that's happened and the huge toll that it's taken on Julian and your family and his family, in the end, was it all worth it do you think?

GABRIEL:

Well, you know, I think I'm not a big believer in regrets. I think really you have to look back at Julian's record and the record of Wikileaks, what they exposed, and I think it speaks for itself. You know, it's a historical record that has changed the lives for the better of many millions of people around the world. People who've been able to educate themselves on what their governments are doing in their name. They've been able to make decisions that actually better their lives in their elections, wars have been ended – the Iraq War came to an end based on one Wikileaks document. So, I think really you should ask the people whose lives this has affected the most and what they think about what Julian did and I think there'll be a resounding show of support for Julian and that work, because of how the lives of normal people have been affected by Julian's work.

ASHLYNNE:

Just going back a little bit. Was there a moment where you realised that this guy that you've grown up with, your brother, your older brother, is suddenly not just your older brother anymore, he's now this character, Julian Assange. Where was the tipping point or the turning point for you?

GABRIEL:

Probably in, I think in 2008. That was when Wikileaks published information, the corruption report on the Kenyan government and led to a change of government in Kenya and some of the people who were working with Julian wound up dead. It was at that point I sort of understood how this invention that Wikileaks was, this invention that Julian made, and how it really threatened the powerful and made powerful people very, very scared. And the lengths that they would go to to protect themselves. And that's probably when I realised the impact that Wikileaks would have on the world.

But Julian's always just been my brother. You know, like I never really go and say, ‘oh, you did a great job there’ and things like that. You know, we're always just having a laugh and making jokes and talking about what we can do next and how I can help him in the campaign to get him out. So yeah, that's our relationship. And yeah, I think, you know, with your family members, they always have that familiarity and, you know, that exists, still exists. Yeah.

ASHLYNNE:

So how does Julian Assange, his story, unfold from here? What do you think he's going to do next?

GABRIEL:

I think he'll, you know, enjoy some time outside of a two by three metre prison cell for a bit with his family, you know, having a swim in the ocean. I'm sure he's looking forward to feeling some of that. Maybe getting sunburnt. You know, something like that, feeling the sand between his toes.

Yeah, it's almost time to celebrate, really. Once he lands and is on home soil, then that's done and he's safe and sound, which is pretty incredible after such a long time of, you know, being detained in the United Kingdom for 14 years. Five years in a maximum security prison. I just, you know, can't imagine what it's like for Julian after spending so long in a two by three metre cell to be walking around out in the open under the sunshine. Yeah, it's a pretty incredible feeling.

ASHLYNNE:

Gabe, I love our podcast, but the one thing I hate about it is that people can't see your smile right now.

GABRIEL:

Yes, I’ve been smiling. I don't usually smile at interviews, but I've been able to smile and just say thank you to everybody for the last 36 hours. You know, which I've been enjoying doing in all the interviews that I've done. So yeah, it's been a long road and a great relief that we're here and that Julian can be free.

ASHLYNNE:

Congratulations, and I really wish you all the best enjoying this next moment as a family. Thanks so much for your time, Gabe.

GABRIEL:

Thanks. Thanks and talk to you soon.

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ASHLYNNE:

Also in the news today:

Prime Minister Anthony Albanese has revealed he has asked that senator Fatima Payman not attend the rest of Labor’s caucus meetings before the winter break, after she crossed the floor and voted against her Labor colleagues and for a Greens motion to recognise the state of Palestine.

Labor Party rules, unlike those of other political parties, mean members can be expelled if they cross the floor and vote against their own party.

And Australia’s monthly inflation rate has increased to its highest level this year, rising to four per cent.

The rise has increased the looming risk that the Reserve Bank could now decide to raise rates, instead of bringing them down, which is something many had anticipated earlier this year.

That’s all from the team at 7am for today. My name’s Ashlynne McGhee. Thanks for your company, I’ll see you again tomorrow.

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