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RUBY:

From Schwartz Media, I’m Ruby Jones. This is 7am.

There’s one relationship the Liberal Party has always prized: its relationship with business.

Other support bases for the party have ebbed and flowed, but it's always drawn from the ranks of corporate Australia, and advocated for their interests.

Now, strangely as the party finds itself in an electoral crisis – the leader of the Federal, Peter Dutton, has been speaking out against business leaders over a surprising topic: the Voice to Parliament.

Today, former Liberal MP and contributor to The Saturday Paper, Julia Banks, on how the Liberal Party is losing corporate Australia over the voice.

It’s Thursday, May 11.

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RUBY:

Julia, it's been a few weeks now since the Opposition Leader, Peter Dutton, announced his decision to campaign against the Voice, the party's decision. So there’s been enough time now for us to see some of the consequences of that decision. And I just wonder, as someone who used to sit in that party room, what you thought when you heard about the direction that Dutton had decided to go in?

JULIA:

Well, I don't think it was a surprise to many people at all, Ruby, that under Peter Dutton's leadership as opposition leader, that they were going to say no, if not for any other reason, but to say no for no’s sake, from negotiating on the safeguard mechanism always had a, sort of, negative approach. There's never been any, sort of, even a glimmer of hope of negotiations. And it was frustrating enough that they said no, because if any referendum should have had a bipartisan approach, it's the Voice. And it was eminently predictable that their ‘No’ position would increase division and disunity within the party. You know, that's frustrating enough, but it was predictable because the party is a sliver of what it used to be. It used to be a broad church initially. But I think with Dutton and Morrison being the key co-ringleaders of the leadership coup, since then we've seen a very hard turn to the right. And that is almost coincided with this whole negativity, this right wing approach, this anti approach and, of course, this inability to negotiate with business.

RUBY:

And this is an unusual position for the Liberal Party to be in – to not be able to work with big business. So, can you tell me about the relationship between business and the Liberal Party, and why that’s traditionally been such a significant touchstone for the Liberal party?

JULIA:

Yeah, the Liberal Party have traditionally been seen as the party for big business, small business.

Archival tape – John Howard:

“This is certainly a remarkably good budget for small business!”

Archival tape – Joe Hockey:

“The budget empowers small businesses to invest, grow, and create jobs!

Archival tape – Malcolm Turnbull:

“Every Australian understands that, you need a strong economy, you need people going to work, you need people starting businesses!”

JULIA:

It's almost like that coincided with the turn to the right, in terms of the diminution of that position in the Liberal Party, and it's actually striking the co-ringleaders, Dutton and Morrison, you know, both have been career politicians most of their adult lives. That's where they've worked, that's where they've enjoyed power.

After the coup against Malcolm Turnbull, it's no coincidence that many people left at that time, including myself.

Archival tape – Channel 7 News:

“Former Liberal MP Julia Banks has made shocking claims about the toxic culture at Parliament House.”

JULIA:

Most of the staffers and ministers on the frontbench in the Liberal Party are like Dutton and Morrison, in terms of, they've worked in politics all their lives. So they don't have that internal understanding of what drives businesses. You know, they've never worked in them. And I think that has changed the culture.

RUBY:

Okay, so let's talk a bit about the idea of the Liberal Party as the party for business, and whether that idea holds. I think that one thing that's interesting to note is that after announcing their stance on the Voice, Peter Dutton and Sussan Ley, they embarked on what they called this listening tour of the country regarding the referendum, and they spoke to Indigenous leaders and also to business leaders. And after meeting business leaders, Dutton said that they were quote, “being played for fools by the Labor Party.” What do you think that he means by that?

JULIA:

Who knows what he means by that. It's just his same response to when big corporates signed up to marriage equality. You know, this idea that big business is some sort of separate entity that shouldn't get involved in politics, it's just outrageous, it’s just stupid. I mean, big business employ millions of Australians around the country. And of course, you know, businesses are going to have, every CEO, every leader, is responsible and accountable for articulating the vision of their organisation. And indeed many businesses have come out to support the ‘Yes’ vote. And that's because I think they recognise, as Danny Gilbert, who is a director of the Business Council of Australia, that this is the nation building moment. I mean they employ thousands of employees. This is about inclusion and diversity. This will be fundamentally far more than something symbolic. It's fundamental and goes to the very core of our, you know, our country. So it's no surprise that big businesses such as the big banks, you know, along with BHP, Wesfarmers, Woolworths, the big retailers, they've all come out in support of the Voice.

Archival tape – Unknown CEO:

“We represent diverse organisations across a range of sectors.”

Archival tape – Unknown CEO:

“Together we make this response to the Uluru Statement from the Heart.”

Archival tape – Unknown CEO:

“Thank you, for your invitation to walk with you.”

Archival tape – Unknown CEO:

“In a movement of all Australian people for a better future.”

Archival tape – Unknown CEO:

“We recognise the Uluru Statement from the Heart as a historic mandate…“

Archival tape – Unknown CEO:

“...to create a fuller expression of Australia’s nationhood.”

JULIA:

As for Peter Dutton telling them, I think he yeah, he told them to butt out basically, that they're being played for fools. So, it's like offensive, appallingly offensive. And then to say that the only reason they're taking up these social causes is that they're craving for social media attention.

He actually said something similar when the marriage equality debate was going on. And, you know, then we had Apple, AGL, Qantas, Telstra, every other big business. And he said, you know, they should concentrate on the economy and on the numbers side of their business. And bizarrely, he said, you know, they should leave these social causes to the politicians and the talkback hosts, he was talking to a talkback host on TV. It's just a ludicrous proposition, and it's offensive, and it has no insights, or clearly based on very limited, if no, experience in working with or working in businesses.

RUBY:

We'll be back after this.

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RUBY:

Julia, this contrast that we’re seeing between corporate Australia's support of the Voice to Parliament versus Peter Dutton and the Coalition's stance against it, what does that say to you about the reality of the relationship between big business and the Liberal Party right now? How damaged do you think it is by this?

JULIA:

I think it's exceedingly damaged. I mean, I think when you've got large businesses saying “we are supporting the voice”, and having to point out to the Liberal Party that they are and, you know, these leaders are representative of the employees, that the millions and millions of employees that are all Australians. I think for the Liberal Party not to recognise that, and to just sort of blithely say “you should butt out, but out of this, leave it to the politicians.”

Archival tape – Jacinta Price:

“Personally I seriously think that sporting codes should stay absolutely out of politics.”

JULIA:

Jacinta Price has come out recently as well, saying, you know, sporting codes shouldn't engage in discussion or thought processes about the Voice.

Archival tape – Jacinta Price:

To me, it’s like a huge virtue signally exercise. It's like a big massive tick in the box.

JULIA:

We're all supposed to sit outside of it on something that will be a truly, you know, foundational moment for our country. If we wake up the next morning after the Voice and we have it in place and constitutional recognition, I mean, I just think their views, and their statements are so blinkered, and so ridiculous that everyone sees it.

RUBY:

So I suppose the main criticism is that this idea that the business community is essentially engaging in, in woke washing or trying to score points by voting ‘Yes’, encouraging people to vote ‘Yes’. I mean I’m not saying that that business should switch sides, but I do wonder if we need to have a bigger and a more nuanced conversation about corporate involvement in the vote, and and perhaps look at the history of some of these companies who might have previously profited from the oppression of Indigenous people, for example, mining companies, and wonder why it is they might be choosing this moment to support the cause. Is there room for scepticism?

JULIA:

I don't think there is. And no one is saying that big business is perfect. Far from it, yeah. Most big businesses make mistakes, and I don't think that's what is driving them to support the Voice. Just like it didn't drive them for support for marriage equality was to launder their reputation. I think it comes more from the fact that they are corporate citizens, and they employ millions and millions of people, and they are an embedded part of the social, economic, and political infrastructure of the country that, you know, and and I think to try and take this cynical approach, which, you know, the Dutton, the Liberal Party, people like Mundine etc., are taking the anti, you know, the ‘No’ vote stance, to try and take this cynical approach and say, “oh, they're doing it because of this.” I think the question should be more about why are you Liberal Party opposing this? Why are you doing this? That's the bigger question. I think corporations and businesses have the right answer to that question, which is we’re corporate citizens, we almost have an obligation to take a position on this, just as we did on marriage equality.

RUBY:

And just finally, as you said, the party has moved to the right. Do you think that there is a way back for vote for the Liberal Party, to something closer to the party that you joined?

JULIA:

Well, I personally can't see it. It's so endemic. And you just have to look at Victoria, which has become a political wasteland because, you know, it starts at the branch level, and structure level in each state. And we've seen this infiltration of the right wing which has pushed out the more moderate progressive views of the party. And at the last federal election, a lot of the MPs who lost to the teal independents at the last election, and indeed to Labor, they saw their position as MPs almost, they saw it as an entitlement, almost like a coronation. You know, this coronational view that they're entitled, and they have this divine right to be the members of Parliament. And it's almost like they've forgotten that there's people out there, like people who are employed by big business, like people, you know, the 100,000 people in each electorate who form their own view.

And they obviously form their view based on what they see. Having worked internally and seen what's going on. I mean, I've been out of there since the right wing really took over. But I think it's pretty obvious for most people to see it, and I saw it brewing at that time around the coup, and you know, it's really taken hold since then.

RUBY:

Julia, thank you so much for your time.

JULIA:

Thank you so much, Ruby. It's always a pleasure to speak with you. Thank you.

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RUBY:

Also in the news today…

Former US President Donald Trump sexually abused writer E. Jean Carroll, and then defamed her by calling her a liar.

A jury in a civil suit has found Trump liable for $5 million US dollars in damages, but ultimately found him not guilt of the charge of rape - which Carroll alleged took place in the mid 90s.

Following the verdict, Trump took to social media to call the finding a “witch hunt”.

And…

Sections of the Banksia Hill Juvenile Detention Centre were set alight during a riot lasting twelve hours.

Around fifty inmates breached their cells, climbed the roof, and lit fires in several accommodation blocks, with multiple police and special operations units being called in to contain the outbreak.

The juvenile facility in Perth detains children as young as 10.

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