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RUBY:

From Schwartz Media I’m Ruby Jones, this is 7am.

In an attempt to fend off allegations of sexism within the Coalition, Prime Minister Scott Morrison reshuffled his cabinet earlier this year.

But his choice for Australia’s new Assistant Minister for Women, Amanda Stoker, has been controversial from the outset.

Her hardline - and conservative - views on abortion have raised concerns from women’s health advocates.

Today - journalist for The Saturday Paper Rachel Withers on the rise of Amanda Stoker.

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RUBY:

Rachel, who is Amanda Stoker and how did she become a senator?

RACHEL:

So Amanda Stoker is a socially conservative Liberal National Party senator from Queensland who's been courting quite a lot of attention recently, particularly in relation to her views on abortion. She's not actually from Queensland. She's from Sydney. But she's been, you know, working in Queensland for most of her adult life as a lawyer.

And she's been an active member of the Liberal Party since the age of 19. She had tried twice before to get into parliament, first state and then federal. Then in 2018 in the lead up to the pre-selection to replace George Brandis, everything seemed to change. Insiders say she went from being a liberal moderate to an arch conservative, seemingly overnight, and she's now seen as a rising star of the Christian right.

RUBY:

Mm ok, so just how abrupt was this shift in her ideology? What actually happened?

RACHEL:

Well, according to the insiders at the time of her pre-selection battle, she started showing up at anti-abortion marches and expressing her support for anti-abortion groups.

Archival Tape -- Amanda Stoker:

“Thank you, one and all for being here to send a clear message to all those who govern that children matter.”

RACHEL:

And in March 2018, she spoke at the yearly March for Life rally, really trotting out many of the standard anti-abortion Christian talking points.

Archival Tape -- Amanda Stoker:

“We know the most fundamental human right is the right to life itself. Article six of the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights provides...”

RACHEL:

She cited the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights to argue that unborn foetuses had an inherent right to life.

Archival Tape -- Amanda Stoker:

“Children and babies may not be able to vote, but we must ensure that they are heard and protected by all those who govern.”

RACHEL:

And later that year, in September, she addressed yet another pro-life rally ahead of the in Queensland’s vote to legalise abortion.

Archival Tape -- Amanda Stoker:

“The premier, Jackie Trad, Yvette D’arth, they’ll tell you…”

RACHEL:

And she said: they will tell you that this legislation is just about taking abortion away from the criminal law and making it a health issue...

Archival Tape -- Amanda Stoker:

“But there could not be a more dishonest smokescreen for late term abortion and for the most radical, death-based abortion laws available in this country.”

RACHEL:

She's often invoked, you know, the unfounded sex selective abortion myth, which claims that people are terminating pregnancies based on the gender of the foetus. And she's argued that women should be forced to face a cooling-off period or counselling before being allowed to access a termination. And she also at the time voiced her opposition to the 150 metre exclusion zone around abortion clinics, arguing that protesters rights to quote, “respectful conversations and silent prayer” had to be upheld.

RUBY:

Mm so it sounds like she has some fairly staunchly conservative views, particularly when it comes to abortion, which is not that common in Australia, really these views. So why do people think that she changed like this? Because, as you've said, she wasn't always this conservative, right?

RACHEL:

Yeah, well, according to the critics who spoke to The Guardian about it earlier this year, it really coincided with her pre-selection battle.

And they say she adopted this persona in order to secure the votes of some of the more socially conservative elements of the base and to raise her profile a bit by piggybacking off the culture wars.

And she's also got a lot of support from the Murdoch media, which has written glowing profiles on her. One in 2019 said that she was quote: “fast becoming the voice for Morrison's quiet Australians”.

Archival Tape -- Alan Jones:

“I've said many times Amanda Stoker is a woman of significant moral courage who describes herself as a proud conservative Christian, who believes Christian values are under attack.”

RACHEL:

And it's also very quick to jump in and defend her. As we saw with Alan Jones last week,

Archival Tape -- Alan Jones:

“We need more Amanda Stokers, who are tolerant in their articulation of views, but also capable of stating those views clearly and in language people understand. That is leadership.”

RACHEL:

And she has rejected the assertions that she, you know, changed her politics in order to be pre-selected. But there isn't really a lot of evidence of her being so committed to this cause before that 2018 pre-selection.

And now, of course, she has the backing of the Christian right in the Liberal National Party in Queensland. And she's also got a few friends within the federal party. She's part of the national right or the hard right, which is the most conservative grouping in the federal party, notionally led by Peter Dutton.

But she's also a member of Scott Morrison's prayer group, which is made up of more than just Pentecostals, it’s a bunch of different religious MPs. And this puts her in a pretty good position, really. The national right has a lot of sway. And she also seems to be a bit of a favourite of Scott Morrison's, who has appointed her to these various assistant ministerships quite early in her term.

Archival Tape -- Scott Morrison:

“And Amanda Stoker will take on the additional role of… she’s currently, uh, Assistant Minister to the Attorney-General. She will add to that Assistant Minister to the Minister for Industrial Relations as well as the Assistant Minister to the Minister for Women.”

RUBY:

So just recently, Amanda Stoker became the Assistant Minister for Women. That happened as part of that cabinet reshuffle that was aimed at addressing allegations of sexism within the Coalition. Let's talk a bit about the reaction to that appointment. How has it been received?

RACHEL:

Yeah, well, there was no small amount of criticism at the time, I think it was probably the most controversial appointment of that reshuffle. And as soon as she was appointed, people started going through many of the hard line conservative positions she's taken in the last couple of years. I will say that criticism had somewhat died down. But then Stoker spoke at another March for Life rally just a couple of weeks ago,

Archival Tape -- Amanda Stoker:

“Hello everyone, how incredible it is to see such a huge sea of faces.”

RACHEL:

and it was the first time she'd done so since being appointed Assistant Minister for Women.

Archival Tape -- Amanda Stoker:

“It takes courage and integrity knowing that there is a section of our community that doesn't only not want to hear you, but will actively demonise you for your own love and for your respect.”

RACHEL:

And in an interview last week with The Australian, she elaborated on those views, saying that late term abortions should be banned even for pregnancies that are the result of rape. And she said that she understood this was a divisive take, but that she simply felt that they were wrong.

And now, of course, more questions being raised about her suitability to hold the role of Assistant Minister for Women. Particularly in light of the most recent comments, there's a bit of outrage because people say it's inappropriate, considering she has such a powerful position and a heightened profile on women's issues.

And abortion is, of course, very much a women's issue. But she's taking the opposite stance to the one held by feminists and women's advocates who argue that women should obviously have autonomy over their own bodies.

RUBY:

We'll be back in a moment.

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RUBY:

Rachel, we've been talking about Senator Amanda Stoker and her suitability to hold the role of Assistant Minister for Women because of her views on abortion. I'd like to know a little bit more about what the criticisms are, why people say that because she has these views, she shouldn't perhaps be in this position?

RACHEL:

So, people have been quite disturbed to hear that the Assistant Minister for Women spouts these really extreme anti-abortion religious talking points, whether or not she authentically believes them, it's concerning to hear them coming from somebody holding a federal portfolio for women.

Archival Tape -- Daile Kelleher:

“We think it's outrageous, basically, that the Assistant Minister for Women is advocating for restrictions or bans on what is simple and safe health care that one in three Australian women access in their lifetime. So we think it's inconsistent absolutely with her role as Assistant Minister for Women,”

RACHEL:

I spoke to Daile Kelleher from Children by Choice, which is a Brisbane based counselling and advocacy group that had a lot to do with the fight to legalise abortion in Queensland in 2018.

Archival Tape -- Daile Kelleher:

“She's simply not taking into account the needs of Australian women and their health care needs.”

RACHEL:

And she said that abortion is simply health care for women,. and Stoker’s efforts to try to criminalise late stage abortions was really advocating to restrict what is simply health care for women.

Stoker has responded to the critics, saying that her views on abortion were not inconsistent with her role as Assistant Minister for Women.

Archival Tape -- Amanda Stoker:

“The fact is, I'm someone who has always fought for free speech.”

RACHEL:

She said that representing women well doesn't mean all women agree on all things.

Archival Tape -- Amanda Stoker:

“If we're going to provide pathways to leadership for women. Then we need to work together and not be trying to tear down anyone who doesn't fit their short term, hard left political objective.”

RUBY:

And what do you make of this position that Stoker is taking, that representing women doesn't mean that you represent all women because all women don’t agree on all things?

RACHEL:

Yeah, it's obviously true to say that women don't agree on all things, especially when it comes to women's policies, the women's movement disagrees all the time; but not when it comes to an issue like abortion, which is about women's fundamental right to decide what to do with their lives and bodies. And it's an essential, hard-won right for gender equality.

It's incompatible to be advocating against women's rights while holding the position of Assistant Minister for Women.

So women like Stoker are, of course, welcome to hold their personal views and to make their own personal choices. That's what being pro-choice is all about. But it's not okay to be advocating to strip Australian women of rights when you hold a federal portfolio that's ostensibly about increasing gender equality because rolling back abortion rights and abortion access would significantly limit women's freedom and their ability to achieve gender equality.

A few of Stokers’ other positions are likewise incompatible with being an Assistant Minister for Women.

Archival Tape -- Amanda Stoker:

“A strong leader, as, as she is, should not be blaming bullying, should not be playing the gender card, should just be getting on with it.”

RACHEL:

She's been dismissive of sexism in the past, accusing women of “playing the gender card” when they speak up about sexist bullying. So not really a great choice for promotion that is meant to make it clear that sexist bullying is not to be tolerated any longer. And she's certainly not Assistant Minister for all women.

Archival Tape -- Amanda Stoker:

“So let's talk about what we do need to do to fairly balance the rights of students who are homosexual or transgender, with the rights of parents and students who want the benefits of a religious school, and the approach to education and values that provides.”

RACHEL:

She's actively opposed transgender rights. And one of her main political issues has been about pushing back on what she and many on the right call “the transgender agenda”.

Archival Tape -- Amanda Stoker:

“But our desire to offer them compassion cannot come at the expense of all other students in a religious school.”

RACHEL:

So, you know, as you can see, she's just trying to roll back rights for women in multiple domains.

RUBY:

Given all of this, Rachel, given the criticism that Amanda Stoker has faced, but also, you know, some of the good reviews that she's been getting as well, how likely is any of this criticism to stick? Do you think there will be much impact in terms of her political future?

RACHEL:

Well, look, it does seem like her outspoken views on some of these issues has already cost her potentially her position in the Senate. So she may not even be in the Senate come next election.

But as for her position as an Assistant Minister for Women, this doesn't really look likely to affect her. There was a lot of outrage at the time she was appointed and they just decided to ride it out. So I don't think this latest round of comments is really going to affect her position.

And her speaking about this does add a little bit of a sheen of legitimacy to the anti-abortion movement, which is a fringe movement now in Australia.

And it really already was before it was officially legalised over the last few years.

But Daile Kelleher of Children by Choice says that, you know, she's not concerned about the law going backwards, but she does worry about some of these more conservative elements of the federal coalition legislating barriers to access at the federal level, which is what, you know, some of her colleagues are attempting to do.

Archival Tape -- Daile Kelleher:

“I think it adds to stigma, or perception of stigma, of termination of pregnancy and abortion, which we know can lead to poor health outcomes.”

RACHEL:

Kelleher told me that even just having Stroker speak about this really adds to the stigma of accessing abortion, you know, within the medical system, which can lead women from disadvantaged backgrounds to avoid accessing it in what is a safe and professional setting.

Archival Tape -- Daile Kelleher:

“So those messages that Amanda Stoker promotes, they've been debunked and disproven time and time again. It's fear mongering, it's inflammatory...”

RACHEL:

It can create worse health outcomes for women, even just having, you know, a public figure like this, creating stigma around the idea of a woman choosing to end a pregnancy.

And while it's unlikely to affect Stoker’s position, it's certainly going to affect the way abortion is thought about by certain women.

RUBY:

Rachel, thank you so much for your time.

RACHEL:

Thank you.

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RUBY:

Also in the news today -

US President Joe Biden has issued a statement expressing support for a ceasefire between Israel and Hamas.

It’s the first time during the current conflict that Biden has called for a ceasefire.

And a Sydney man has died in India after contracting COVID-19.

Govind Kant travelled to India in April after the death of his mother. The 47 year old subsequently contracted COVID-19, before passing away this week.

The ban on travel from India into Australia was lifted over the weekend, but thousands of Australians remain trapped in the country.

I’m Ruby Jones, this is 7am. See ya tomorrow.

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