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ANGE:

From Schwartz Media, I’m Ange McCormack. This is 7am.

Teal MP Zali Steggall has used her time in Parliament to advocate for stronger climate targets, and criticised both Labor and Coalition governments for not acting fast enough.

Now she’s calling for an urgent change to our climate targets in Australia; one that would include every sector in the economy.

Today, the Member for Warringah, Zali Steggall, on what climate action she wants to see next, and why the government’s targets on the energy sector aren’t going far enough.

It’s Wednesday October 25th.

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ANGE:

Zali Steggall, you were elected in 2019 on a platform of climate action and you've been pushing the Labor government to do more. I'm curious to know what your meetings with the Prime Minister are like.

ZALI:

Look, obviously Chatham House rules. I can't completely say everything, but I have on a regular basis raised the need for the government to get more ambitious when it comes to its climate action, in particular its emission reduction targets. I feel strongly with many members of the crossbench that the current government's emissions reduction target of 43% emissions reduction on 2005 levels by 2030 was a political target. Essentially, it was something that was a little better than the Coalition, but not sufficient to really be compliant with the science.

We pushed the government to acknowledge that it was a floor, not a ceiling, and that they would need to put in place policies that would deliver greater ambition.

My my criticism is that we haven't really seen that happen yet. So the focus has been in discussions with the Prime Minister and the Minister for Climate Change around we're coming off a record season when we look at the northern hemisphere of temperatures, when it comes to sea temperatures and air temperatures, bushfires, the level of risk is accelerating, and the safety of our communities is really at stake. And so it's very clear action needs to accelerate.

ANGE:

So what more specifically still needs to be done by the government to curb climate change in your view?

ZALI:

Well, the Government needs to be much more specific about where our pathways are and what needs to be done. So there's been a fairly good focus on the energy system and the government has a focus of a target of 82% renewable by 2030, which I think is good, right, that we need to achieve that. But at the same time we need every sector, right? Energy is not the only sector that needs to do it. So I've been pushing the government for quite a long time around sectoral targets. So that is we are not going to get to net zero on the energy sector alone. We need transport emissions to come down.

Transport is about 20% of our national emissions. So the question would be by 2030, should we halve those emissions? So if we put in place and legislate a sectoral target in the transport sector, a 50% reduction by 2030, that means you then have experts go and look at the transport sector and say, right, this percentage comes from heavy freighting. What options have we got to fix that? And we know there's already electric heavy freights coming on board. There's a stop and go system you know along the East Coast. Better fuel standards reduces emissions, better filters on cars. You know, there is a number of things. So if we set that target in the transport sector, a 50% reduction by 2030, you would have to have the heavy transport would have to look at their contribution and how much they can reduce it. Then we would look at passenger cars. So yeah, mums and dads and everybody. What percentage have cars that are coming to end of life?

Then we have to look at industry, We need to look at agriculture. So every sector needs to be done. Now, the Minister for Climate Change, Chris Bowen, put a motion to the Parliament a little while ago asking the Climate Authority to report back to the Government on sectoral targets, but they are not reporting back until the 1st of July 2024 and you have to then think it's going to take the government to respond to that recommendation. It means that the Albanese Government won't be acting on those sectoral targets. They will be taking those sectoral targets to the next election, the next federal election, which will be early 2025 likely. So that means we will have had three years of very little progress around any other sector other than energy. And that's just not good enough when time is of the essence.

ANGE:

And I think if you asked climate scientists about those ideas or what you're calling for, they'd agree that it's a great idea and will help lower emissions. But you're saying that the government isn't acting fast enough on implementing or looking at things like sectoral targets. Why do you think the government isn't listening to you or acting fast enough?

ZALI:

Well, I think we have an interesting dual duopoly at the moment when it comes to the government where traditionally you have a party of government is put under pressure through its policies by the opposition, which comes up with a better, more efficient policy that meets the needs of the population. And as such you have that competitive tension and everyone is pushed into doing better, right for the community. What we have here is a well, it's a vacuum when it comes to the coalition. They have no plan, right? They have no sectoral targets. In fact, their policy is to distract everyone by saying continue with business as usual for the next ten, 15 years, keep going with coal fired power station and gas. And then we will bring in this mythical idea of nuclear in 15 to 20 years time. So this is all a distraction and a delaying tactic to avoid transitioning everything now over the next ten years.

So in the meantime, you have the Labor government that is kind of sitting on the fence, right? They are on one hand wanting to appear like they're acting on climate change and to an extent they are better than the coalition. They have enacted certain things, but at the same time they are approving new coal and gas projects that absolutely blow out of the water any emissions reduction we achieve. And they're doing all this under the pretext that we've passed the legislation called the safeguard mechanism, and it forces our biggest emitters to offset their emissions. And so somehow that means we can have new projects can come into the mix, but as long as they're offsetting, she'll be right. It's not going to get us to net zero by 2050. And it's certainly not going to get us to keeping temperatures as close to 1.5.

ANGE:

After the break - how different are Zali Steggall’s climate negotiations with Labor to the previous government?

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Audio excerpt – Zali Steggall:

“I am confident that this bill will not only address some of the needs to reduce emissions, but it will also create opportunities. Coupled with sensible policy, we can in fact prepare Australia, build an economy that is fit for purpose for the future.”

ANGE:

Zali Steggall, Earlier this year you voted for the government's key climate change bill, the safeguard mechanism. And even though you said at the time that it wasn't perfect, if you want to force the government to improve our climate targets, wasn't that the opportunity to hold out for more? Because it's unlikely to be revisited this term, isn't it?

ZALI:

Well, the safeguard mechanism was an important piece of legislation to put in place because it forces our top 200 biggest emitters to either offset or reduce. We did achieve some amendments with the government in particular around that we had to cap gross emissions and then we had to have real reductions. So whilst the government insisted on them, we conceded the question around that they could be up to 100% offsets. The gross emissions must come down over time. So that was an important part because it means you cannot continually keep growing the pie, right? But it has to still have a gross reduction over time, which meant new players into the industries, for example, could not increase such a share of emissions. It continually had to come down.

So on the whole, I think that is good and it has the ability to be tightened further, the safeguard mechanism. So obviously it's only been in place for a few months. We will see next year the first year of its application in effect, and hopefully that starts to see some emissions reduction in those big emitting sectors. So whilst not perfect in conjunction with other pieces of legislation, the safeguard mechanism can be effective in bringing down emissions.

The difficulty we have is if that legislation was delayed, you create vast uncertainty in the market and this is a very competitive global market around that transition. But a big key to this puzzle is also the electrification of households. And ultimately it's win win households save money and reduce emissions. So these are the things we need to be focussed on.

Yes, safeguard is not perfect, but it's a part of the puzzle and we can keep adding to that puzzle. I am a big believer in you can't let perfect be the enemy of good and we need to start progressing these areas because if not, these industries just won't get there. And we've had ten years of delay under the Coalition and so blocking everything, you start gradually and then you start accelerating and get them sprinting.

ANGE:

And I'm wondering what the difference has been like in negotiating on climate change with this government compared to the previous government. It's quite a different make up both in government and in Parliament and who you've got alongside you in the crossbench.

Zali Steggall:

The Government has been receptive to it. I mean many talked of the 22 election as being the climate election. I'm not sure it's quite the climate election yet. I think the 2025 needs to be the climate election because we're still saying the Labor Party accepts donations from the minerals fossil fuel sector. They are still very focussed on their political interest versus the scientific need and around each policy area. So if you look at the kind of language, for example, Madeleine King uses as the Minister for Resources, she will talk about how gas has a long term role, you know, in the Australian economy for years to come.

Audio excerpt – Madeline King:

“We will still need to use some fossil fuels to get us through this. We want to increase activity in renewables. We have a commitment to net-zero emissions by 2050, but even as the International Energy Agency has acknowledged we will need to keep using products such as gas to make sure we can process critical minerals which will be required…”

ZALI:

From the Prime Minister down, they are always very keen to talk up that, you know, we will continue exporting thermal coal for as long as there is a market for it internationally. Communities that rely on that will, you know, will continue to be able to for as long as that's needed. Gas and fossil fuels is a part of our future. This is a language the government still uses. So to me it's still a disconnect with the reality that we are fast approaching tipping points that will be very hard to pull back from. That will have serious consequences. And this is only going to keep getting worse. We look at the scale of bushfires and flooding events over the Northern Hemisphere summer and it's a real worry. I'm very worried about the safety and health of our communities.

ANGE:

And do you still hold out hope that governments can move fast enough to avert the kind of crisis that we've been talking about and that we could be living in in 2030?

ZALI:

Well, we have to. I am a glass half full kind of person. I don't believe you ever quit a race, and you have to keep focussed. And there will be setbacks. And it's not easy, but you have to keep adjusting and finding a new a new angle or a new looking for solutions. So I do think the closer we get to things really getting dramatic, the more social licence and the public will just not tolerate governments drag their feet.

So it does come down to the population, it comes down to the Australian people to really think through their safety, security and opportunity for themselves because this is happening now and there is no doubt the the direction we're heading, but we have the opportunities and we have the tech and we we really have the skills. We just need to capture that drive and ambition.

ANGE:

Zali Steggall, thanks so much for your time today.

ZALI:

Thank you.

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ANGE:

Also in the news today…

The United States has sent senior military officers to Israel to advise on military operations and urban combat against targets in Gaza.

The group includes Lieutenant General James Glynn of the US Marines, who fought in the battle of Fallujah during the Iraq War.

And

Five homes have been lost in bushfires in Southern Queensland, according to a QFES superintendent, but nobody has been hurt.

There were more than 40 fires burning across the state yesterday, with more than 400 volunteers and staff working to control the blazes.

I’m Ange McCormack, this is 7am. We’ll be back again tomorrow.

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